Is donation to scout camp tax deductible?

[eblood66]

Should a scoutmaster be required to buy his own uniform or should that be a budget item?

Handbook 2 section 8.13.7 says that church funds can't be used to buy uniforms (at the very end of the section).

[Gary_Miller]

Should a scoutmaster be required to buy his own uniform or should that be a budget item?

This has always been a struggle for me as the cost of uniforms are very expensive and the HB states: Church funds may not be used to purchase uniforms for individuals. Where I agree on this when it comes to uniforms for the Young Men. I feel there needs to be some discretion when it comes to leaders especially when you look at the principles of the Budget Allowance. I think there maybe times when funds may have to be used in order to reduce the financial burdens on placed on YM Leaders in order to set the proper example for the Young Men.

From the Budget Allowance Training conducted in 1990.

"Not so well understood, and perhaps less appreciated, is the announcement pertaining to local unit budgets. It will be helpful if we keep in mind the principles that govern the budget allowance program:

• The budget allowance program was created to reduce financial burdens on members.
• Members should not pay fees or be assessed to participate in Church programs.
• Priesthood leaders should reduce and simplify activities whenever possible.
• Activities should be planned at little or no cost, should build testimonies and provide meaningful service to others." (The Lord’s Way, Preisident Thomas S. Monson, Budget Allowance Training, May 1990 Ensign)

[aebrown]

I know that is the ideal, Aaron, but the reality is very different.

(It's Alan, by the way, but Aaron is a good name, too.) I certainly understand that Scouting can be expensive. You'll note that I simply brought up the Handbook section about equitable YM/YW budgets for consideration. In each ward, the bishop has the responsibility and the inspiration and the keys to determine exactly what needs to be done, considering the Handbook and the particular situation in his ward.

Should a scoutmaster be required to buy his own uniform or should that be a budget item?

eblood66 referenced the relevant Handbook section. I would also refer you to the Scouting Handbook for Church Units in the United States, which says in Section 8.14:

Young men registered in a Scouting unit are encouraged to wear the appropriate uniform. No young man or boy should be excluded from Scouting if he is unable to purchase a uniform. Units may wish to maintain a supply of used uniforms to make them available for boys. Abbreviated or simple uniforms and insignia, which have been approved by the BSA, are appropriate and encouraged. Adult leaders are also encouraged to wear appropriate Scouting uniforms, where feasible.

The fact that it uses the term "where feasible" tells me that the Church is sensitive to the burden purchasing a uniform may place on a leader. The spirit of that statement about no young man be excluded from Scouting if he is unable to purchase a uniform seems like it would apply to leaders as well. Again, the bishop should consider the totality of the situation in making this judgment call.

[TinMan]

Sorry Alan.

But haven't you been arguing that, for example, boys/parents should not be asked to pay for scout camp? But they should be asked to buy a uniform? Is it just apples and oranges?

What about Woodbadge training? Should that come out of the ward budget or should the scout leader be expected to pay that on his own? And I won't even ask about Philmont, a week long camp for a leader and his entire family...

All these things that are "encouraged" and "where feasible" are certainly grey areas. The BSA/LDS relationship is very complicated.

And expensive. More expensive than the YW program.

[lajackson]

And I won't even ask about Philmont, a week long camp for a leader and his entire family...

A stake president is asked to send certain members of his stake to Philmont and told he should fund it out of the stake budget. We fund the leader and let him fund his family.

[johnshaw]

Dump Scouting in favor of Duty to God

Problem Solved!

And if you think I'm just a BSA-hater, you can make that assumption, but as a boy I was all-in, worked at scout camps, the whole nine-yards... As an adult, I see it differently.

[TinMan]

You'll note that I simply brought up the Handbook section about equitable YM/YW budgets for consideration. In each ward, the bishop has the responsibility and the inspiration and the keys to determine exactly what needs to be done, considering the Handbook and the particular situation in his ward.

We look at "equitable" as equal in what we do. For example: The boys go to scout camp for a week, we take the YW for a week of camping. Maybe 3 or 4 days of girls camp and a second 2 or 3 days of a backpacking trip. All for about half the cost of an organized scout camp.

The boys go shotgun shooting and rappelling on a Friday/Saturday, the boys have free use on Friday, but we take the girls out Saturday morning and have the boys in the background helping them "learn the ropes" so to speak. Yeah, we pay for a campground and food for the boys to stay over night, but the girls have a great experience on Saturday they would never otherwise have. Equal experiences doesn't mean the budgets are equal. And they never will be.

[TinMan]

A stake president is asked to send certain members of his stake to Philmont and told he should fund it out of the stake budget. We fund the leader and let him fund his family.

And I assume the stake funds something similar for certain Young Women leaders and their families? Maybe a week in Florida?

Or is "equitable" only for wards and bishops to figure out?

[aebrown]

But haven't you been arguing that, for example, boys/parents should not be asked to pay for scout camp? But they should be asked to buy a uniform? Is it just apples and oranges?

No, you must be confusing me with someone else, except on the point of asking parents to pay -- I'm strongly against that practice. I'm fine with following the Handbook, which lists options for funding scout camps when budget funds are not sufficient. The first alternative is to have youth earn the money and pay for all or part of scout camp.

And I didn't say that they should be asked to buy a uniform. I simply support the Handbook, which says that budget funds are not to be used to pay for uniforms, and the Scouting Handbook, which emphasizes that inability to buy a uniform should not prevent someone from participating in scouting, and offers suggestions for reducing or eliminating the cost of uniforms. I'm the last person you'll find saying that parents or scouts must buy a uniform. The most important thing is to have the young men participating, and any obstacle to that participation should be eliminated.

[lajackson]

And I assume the stake funds something similar for certain Young Women leaders and their families? Maybe a week in Florida?

Or is "equitable" only for wards and bishops to figure out?

The stake does what the letter from Church headquarters says to do. There is nothing in the letter about sending certain YW leaders to Florida for a week (probably because women do not serve in this particular leadership position).

And since Florida is outside of our stake boundaries, we would have to ask permission from the Presidents of the Seventy to do that, anyway. [grin]

Some kidding aside, I do hear and understand what you are saying, and I do not have a good answer for obtaining balance between YM and YW activities. I know what I did when I was in a position to be responsible for such things. It worked for me.

I am not sure what I would to today. The laws where I live make it extremely difficult to hold any youth activity that spans more than two nights without great expense.