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Broadcast Licence to View General Conference on Chapel internet

Discuss various issues around providing Internet access to meetinghouses.

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Broadcast Licence to View General Conference on Chapel internet

#1Postby sphester » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:39 pm

Hi All

I was recently told the following regarding viewing General COnference over the internet in meeting house.

[font="]"With regard to General Conference, we shouldn’t use the internet to show it in meetinghouses, the Church doesn’t hold a licence to broadcast it in this form in meetinghouses. The only reasonable alternative is to travel to the unit with the shortest journey ."[/font]

I would be grateful for any clarification people have on this? I'm a stake tech in the UK and find it hard to believe we need a special licence to view conference on the internet. And if we do then the church best get a licence as having the facility would be a great benefit as mention on the churches on tech web site thus reducing travel for members at a financially difficult time.

Thanks

Simon
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#2Postby russellhltn » Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:07 pm

I can't think of anything that would come into play in the U.S. But I notice that you're in England and I know they have different tax structures with relationship to television. I suspect this is the issue.

Edit: Since this is appears to be a country-specific issue, as well as a legal/tax issue, I'd suggest contacting your Area Office for instruction.
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#3Postby dannykos » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:22 pm

I got that letter too - seems fair enough. Current UK law states something to the effect that watching ANYTHING live online requires a TV license. Even though the broadcast is coming from outside the UK - I imagine there's still an issue with it.
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#4Postby sphester » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:31 pm

But what about the satellite broadcasts they are also live and effectively TV surely we must havea TV icence for these also.

Aslo you have to bare in mind that given the times we watch it only 3 (2 if you miss the 9-11 session on Sunday) of these sessions are live the rest are recorded so I assume these recorded sessions would not be covered by the licence.

Just seems such a waste to get the internet and then not be able to use it for one of the key benefits thus helping more members see conference with out the need for expensive travel.

But if that's the law then we will have to obey just quite disappointed really. Will also e-mail the area office.
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#5Postby russellhltn » Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:19 am

sphester wrote:But what about the satellite broadcasts they are also live and effectively TV surely we must havea TV icence for these also.


I'm guessing the church has paid the license for the chapels that have satellite systems.

sphester wrote:Aslo you have to bare in mind that given the times we watch it only 3 (2 if you miss the 9-11 session on Sunday) of these sessions are live the rest are recorded so I assume these recorded sessions would not be covered by the licence.


Edit: It appears this site describes the situation. I don't see any exceptions for only a few programs a year.

I would imagine that in the long run the church would end up paying for a license for all the chapels, but it probably first needs to put that in the budget.
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#6Postby sphester » Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:48 am

Well a quick look on the UK TV licensing web site suggests that for the viewing of satellite broadcast the church must have some form of TV licence (i guess some kind of business one). Like you say RussellHltn perhaps they only have a licence for those building with the satellite systems installed which would exclude those that are now getting broadband.

I just hope it changes as it will be a big disappointment to members in my stake that are very spread out if they can't use the internet to view conference.

And of course this all becomes immaterial if the connections don't get fast enough speeds to stream it live. I know my chapel only gets 2meg so I'm not sure conference over internet would be a great thing but then we have the satellite system also.

I will e-mail the area office for clarification one what's happening with this.
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#7Postby sphester » Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:50 am

The local FM group have now confirmed as thought that in the UK you need a TV licence for each building that views conference no the satellite system and if you want to watch on the internet you also need a TV Licence.

What is even worse is in my reading of the terms and condition the TV Licence, you have to have one for any program that you watch over the internet that being shown at the same time on the TV/Satellite channel. This means the rebroadcast cast Sunday sessions even though not live can't be watch over the internet as they are being rebroadcast over the satellite system so are being show on the TV/Satellite at the same time as the internet.

Now looking into possibility of the local units buying there own TV licene if central budgets won't cover them. The cost saving in petrol for 2 annual trips to conference would more than cover the cost of the licence and make conference more accessible to more members.
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#8Postby silid » Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:26 am

The problem with the TV Licence website is that it is designed to tell you that you do need a licence and it doesn't easily tell you what you can do without one.

I believe you can watch live streams that are not being broadcast to the UK as TV services and it is the service that is significant.

So for example if you watch a live stream of BYUtv as it is being broadcast to Europe you would need a licence. But if you watch a live stream of an event you don't need a licence if you aren't watching it as part of a broadcast service, even if that event is also being broadcast on a TV service. So you can watch a conference stream even if conference is also on BYUtv.

This gets even more interesting in the UK as during conference BYUtv isn't broadcast, but instead the Church uses it for 'Private Broadcasts'. Is a TV licence even needed if you only watch the 'private broadcasts'? No - but as they are broadcast in the clear are they really private? If they are still considered broadcast - and the 'event stream' is the same then the 'event stream' will need a licence, but as BYUtv isn't being broadcast at the same time - that shouldn't need a licence.

As you can see the logic is a little dizzying - and so this is probably why you are told to get a licence. However remember you can get a refund on unused quarters. So you could buy a licence and apply for the refund following conference of 75% of the cost and do it again 6 months later.
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#9Postby silid » Sun Oct 30, 2011 12:53 pm

From the TV Licencing Manual wrote:Foreign channels that I receive on my computer
The licensing requirement depends on whether the channel that you are
watching on your computer is available on terrestrial, satellite or cable in the
UK or Channel Islands at the same time as you are viewing it.
If the channel is available on terrestrial, satellite or cable in the UK or Channel
Islands at the same time as you are viewing it, then you will need a licence.
If the channel you are watching on your computer is not available on
terrestrial, satellite or cable in the UK or Channel Islands at the same time as
you are viewing it, then you will not need a licence.
If you are watching content that is not broadcast live, for example on-demand
content, then you will not need a licence.

That may help - what do you think?
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#10Postby russellhltn » Sun Oct 30, 2011 1:06 pm

silid wrote:That may help - what do you think?


Taken at face value, it appears that you'd have to stream conference at a different time to avoid the license.

But, if you go down that road, my fear would be that over time the local leaders would forget why the odd times are used and move it back to "live".
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