Discuss questions around local unit policies for budgeting, reconciling, etc. This forum should not contain specific financial or membership information.
jimmyrun wrote:As to the questions, I am looking at the Budget report and the I&E report and wondering if there should be some correlation between the ending/remaining balance between the reports?
It depends if you are a ward or a stake. If a ward, you remaining balance on 19 Oct 2010 should be $0. If you are a stake, you should have a remaining balance equal to the total remaining budget funds for the stake. However, to get the correct amount, CUBS shows a negative balance forward for 2010. The budget report does not contain this info and will therefore give you the wrong amount. In fact, budget reports cannot span fiscal years and therefore do not ever have balance forwards amounts other than $0 (when the starting date is 1 Jan. Balance forward amounts do show but only when the starting date is not 1 Jan, and then only show a balance forward from the current year. No prior year balances are included). See post #18 in this thread for more about this. So no, the remaining balance on these 2 reports will NOT match.
The budget report also contains an allocations column that is not in the I&E report. If you have re-entered your entire 2010 budget amounts in the View/edit Budget screen, then your total remaining balances from the two reports will definitely not match (and your budget report value will be wrong). You have essentially doubled your income because you have the starting amount you entered plus the transfers CUBS added to zero out all expenses up to the 17th of October (see below). Again, I&E shows you the correct amount in this scenario as well.
jimmyrun wrote:All of my category budget amounts are correct, except for the Administration as it has that transfer in it
This is because of the zeroing CUBS did. On 19 Oct 2010, you should see an expenses amount in Budget:Budget Administration equal to your YTD expenses to that date. You should also see a transfers amount equal to the YTD expenses but opposite in sign. This is how CUBS zeroed out your budget. The transfer is essentially the amount of your 2010 budget that has been spent. Because post-conversion everything has been zeroed, you starting balances in the view/update budget screen need to be the original amount(s) MINUS the total expenses from 1 Jan 2010 to 18 Oct 2010.
Given your example, it would appear that on Oct 18 your YTD expenses were $400 and was zeroed by the $400 in the transfers column. Since then, you have spent an additional $100, giving you YTD expenses of $500. Your subcategory started on Oct 19th with a balance of $600 (The original $1000 - $400 you had already spent). From how CUBS views you expenses (from date of conversion on), your total expenses are now $100 (everything pre-CUBS was zeroed) and your remaining balance is $600 - $100 = $500.
Because you have re-entered you total 2010 budget amounts (appear in the Allocations column), you have credited yourself the $400 twice. So your remaining balance is showing $500 + $400 = $900.
jimmyrun wrote:is this maybe because as crislapi said I only moved the expense and haven’t done the transfer at the end of the year he was talking about?
It seems mostly because you entered your total 2010 budget amounts. Because you recategorized your expenses, only your sub-category remaining balances will be correct. You have to ignore the Budget:Budget Administration remaining balance and the overall remaining balance as shown in the Budget report as they are incorrect.
jimmyrun wrote:...how am I going to handle organizations that are front-heavy in their spending, meaning that they spend the majority of their budget in the first quarter or first half of the year? Will the church allow for checks to be written that would exceed the amount in the ward account as long as that amount is made up by having the organization get out of the negative balance that is sitting in that category?
You are allowed to go negative. Checks will still be covered. The remaining monthly balance will follow them forward month to month and year to year. I suspect if your overall Budget amount is negative, it will appear as an action item on your CUFS, but the stake will be the ones who monitor this. Best would be to check with them how they will handle this.
Maybe a bit more detail will help. Let's begin just prior to CUBS conversion. Let's assume this is a ward with a $7,000 budget for all of 2010. For simplicity, I will only have two subcategories - Budget & RS. Also, let's assume Budget has been allocated $6,000 and RS has $1,000. Finally, let's assume that from 1 Jan to Oct 17th, Budget had spent $4,600 and RS had spent $400, for a total of $5,000.
At this point, Budget has $1,400 remaining for the year while RS has $600 (total of $2,000). If I had budget and income & expense reports for this, they would look something like this:
Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 17 Oct 2010): Category_______Alloc____Bal.For.__Inc_______Exp________Tran_________Bal Budget______$6,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$4,600.00______$0.00____$1,400.00 ReliefSoc___$1,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00____-$400.00______$0.00______$600.00 Total:______$7,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00______$0.00____$2,000.00
Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 17 Oct 2010): Category_____Bal.For.___Inc______Exp_________Tran________Bal Budget:________$0.00 __$0.00__-$4,600.00___$4,600.00_____$0.00 ReliefSoc______$0.00___$0.00____-$400.00_____$400.00_____$0.00 Total:_________$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00___$5,000.00_____$0.00
Note that I&E did not show remaining balance pre-CUBS. Also note that the remaining balance is $2,000 ($1,400 and $600 respectively).
Just after conversion, all sub-category detail was lost along with all allocation information. All pre-CUBS expenses were moved to Budget:Administration and then zeroed w/ a transfer equal to the total expenses. So on 18 Oct, the same reports would look like this (18th is to ensure covering transfers for checks cut on the 17th are included):
CUBS - Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 18 Oct 2010): Category_______Alloc____Bal.For.__Inc_______Exp________Tran_________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 ___$0.00___$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00___$5,000.00______$0.00Total:_________$0.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00___$5,000.00______$0.00
CUBS - Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 18 Oct 2010): Category_____Bal.For.___Inc______Exp_________Tran________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 __$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00_____$0.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 __$0.00__-$5,000.00___$5,000.00_____$0.00Total:_________$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00___$5,000.00_____$0.00
Note that both reports show a balance of zero. This is correct/expected. There IS a bug with the conversion that does in fact cause many wards to show a negative balance. That will be patched soon. For now, just know that on 19 Oct, all budget categories should have started with $0.
Let's assume post conversion I have decided to use Budget:Ward in place of my old Budget and Budget:RS in place of my old ReliefSoc. I have recategorized all my expenses, which moved $400 in expenses back to Budget:RS and $4,600 back to Budget:Ward. I have re-entered my budget allocations ($1,000 and $6,000). The reports now look like this:
CUBS - Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 18 Oct 2010): Category_________Alloc____Bal.For.__Inc_______Exp________Tran_________BalBudget:Alloc______$0.00 ___$0.00___$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00________$0.00Budget:Admin______$0.00 ___$0.00___$0.00_______$0.00___$5,000.00____$5,000.00 Budget:RS_____$1,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00____-$400.00_______$0.00______$600.00Budget:Ward___$6,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$4,600.00_______$0.00____$1,400.00 Total:________$7,000.00 ___$0.00___$0.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00____$7,000.00
CUBS - Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 18 Oct 2010): Category_____Bal.For.___Inc______Exp_________Tran________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 __$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00_______$0.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 __$0.00_______$0.00__$5,000.00___$5,000.00Budget:RS______$0.00___$0.00____-$400.00______$0.00____-$400.00Budget:Ward____$0.00 __$0.00__-$4,600.00______$0.00__-$4,600.00Total:_________$0.00___$0.00__-$5,000.00__$5,000.00_______$0.00
The budget report shows a remaining balance of $7,000 instead of $2,000. Why? The values in the allocations and expenses columns are the same. The difference is the zeroing transfer that appears post-conversion. To start Oct 19th at zero, CUBS zeroed out all expenses by taking $5,000 of the budget and transferring it to Budget:Admin. When I re-entered my full budget allocation of $7,000, I credited myself that same $5,000 again. So the $2,000 true remaining balance plus the double credit of $5,000 is the INCORRECT $7,000 amount the budget report now shows.
In fact, because I still have not received a check from the stake, the I&E report is showing my true remaining balance as of right now - $0.
If we now move to the present, the I&E will show an increasingly negative amount. Let's assume since the conversion, the RS has spent an additional $100 (total of $500 for the year). Let's also assume the stake has given us the check for our remaining $2,000. I have deposited this into Budget:Alloc.
CUBS - Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010): Category_________Alloc____Bal.For._____Inc_______Exp________Tran_________BalBudget:Alloc______$0.00 ___$0.00___$2,000.00_______$0.00_______$0.00____$2,000.00Budget:Admin______$0.00 ___$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00___$5,000.00____$5,000.00 Budget:RS_____$1,000.00 ___$0.00_______$0.00____-$500.00_______$0.00______$500.00Budget:Ward___$6,000.00 ___$0.00_______$0.00__-$4,600.00_______$0.00____$1,400.00Total:________$7,000.00 ___$0.00___$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00____$8,900.00
CUBS - Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010): Category_____Bal.For.___Inc_________Exp_________Tran________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 __$2,000.00_______$0.00_______$0.00___$2,000.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 ______$0.00_______$0.00___$5,000.00___$5,000.00 Budget:RS______$0.00_______$0.00____-$500.00_______$0.00____-$500.00Budget:Ward____$0.00 ______$0.00__-$4,600.00_______$0.00__-$4,600.00Total:_________$0.00___$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00___$1,900.00
Note that while my budget report remaining balance for my new sub-categories are correct, the total remaining balance is even more incorrect.* While it did have the new $100 in expenses deducted from it, the allocation amount has been added to the already incorrect remaining balance. However, the I&E reflects the true total remaining balance (but not sub-category balances) of $1,900 ($2,000 at time of conversion minus new $100 in expenses). *Budget report would show the correct remaining balance if, when it's run, I unselect/don't include the Budget:Alloc and Budget:Admin subcategories.
The budget report is extremely useful, especially in detail form, for the auxiliaries. It is desirable to get it to show the correct amounts. However, that will involve some manipulation. To regain correct subcategory information, you have to decide which report you want to use. You cannot use both (at least not how we used to).
If I decide to recreate accurate subcategory information in the budget report, I must now do the following:
1) Transfer $400 and $4,600 from Budget:Admin to Budget:RS and Budget:Ward respectively (zeroes out pre-CUBS expenses)
2) Reduce the Allocation amounts to what was remaining at the time of conversion ($600 and $1,400)
Only the I&E report shows the correct total remaining balance*. Budget shows correct sub-category info while I&E only shows total expenses since conversion for each. If you go this route, you will probably have to do a lot of explaining to your committees about how you really did not reduce their total budget. For this reason, I am holding off doing the transfers until the end of the year. *Budget report would show the correct remaining balance if, when it's run, I unselect/don't include the Budget:Alloc subcategory.
CUBS - Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010): Category_________Alloc____Bal.For.____Inc_______Exp________Tran_________BalBudget:Alloc______$0.00 ___$0.00__$2,000.00_______$0.00_______$0.00__$2,000.00Budget:Admin______$0.00 ___$0.00______$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00 Budget:RS_______$600.00 ___$0.00______$0.00____-$500.00_____$400.00____$500.00Budget:Ward___$1,400.00___$0.00______$0.00__-$4,600.00___$4,600.00__$1,400.00Total:________$2,000.00 ___$0.00__$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00__$3,900.00
CUBS - Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010):Category_____Bal.For._____Inc_________Exp_________Tran________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 __$2,000.00_______$0.00_______$0.00__$2,000.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 ______$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00 Budget:RS______$0.00 ______$0.00____-$500.00_____$400.00___-$100.00Budget:Ward____$0.00 ______$0.00__-$4,600.00___$4,600.00______$0.00Total:_________$0.00 __$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00__$1,900.00
If, instead, you chose Income & Expense reports, you must do the following:
1) Transfer $400 and $4,600 from Budget:Admin to Budget:RS and Budget:Ward respectively (zeroes out pre-CUBS expenses)
2) Transfer from Budget:Alloc to each subcategory it's remaining balance at the time of conversion ($600 and $1,400) This results in total transfers equal to 2010 allotment
2) Remove the Allocation amounts from view/edit Budget.
Both reports show the correct remaining balance. Both reports shows correct sub-category remaining balance as well. The confusing thing is that it will appear on the budget report that each sub-category started the year w/ $0. This is going to be confusing for members and even clerks to understand. It is harder to read from the report what the yearly allotted amount is.
CUBS - Budget report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010): Category______Alloc____Bal.For.____Inc_______Exp________Tran_________BalBudget:Alloc__$0.00 ___$0.00__$2,000.00_______$0.00__-$2,000.00______$0.00Budget:Admin__$0.00 ___$0.00______$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00 Budget:RS_____$0.00 ___$0.00______$0.00____-$500.00___$1,000.00____$500.00Budget:Ward___$0.00 ___$0.00______$0.00__-$4,600.00___$6,000.00__$1,400.00Total:________$0.00 ___$0.00__$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00__$1,900.00
CUBS - Income & Expense report (1 Jan 2010 - 15 Nov 2010):Category_____Bal.For._____Inc_________Exp_________Tran________BalBudget:Alloc___$0.00 __$2,000.00_______$0.00__-$2,000.00______$0.00Budget:Admin___$0.00 ______$0.00_______$0.00_______$0.00______$0.00 Budget:RS______$0.00_______$0.00____-$500.00___$1,000.00____$500.00Budget:Ward____$0.00 _______$.00__-$4,600.00___$6,000.00__$1,400.00Total:_________$0.00___$2,000.00__-$5,100.00___$5,000.00__$1,900.00
Having beaten this to death, let me say that I'm still undecided which path is best. I believe CUBS is easier to understand if I use I&E reports because CUBS does allow for balance forwards from one year to the next. The I&E report can handle this; the budget report cannot. Also, it is harder to get inflated remaining balance info when using I&E reports. The budget report is much more susceptible to producing balance errors.
However, considering those who will use the reports, I think for most people the budget report is much more readable and easy to understand than the I&E. Starting amount in the left most column, adjustments as I read left to right, and remaining balance on the far right. Also, the view/edit budget screen allows us to set yearly budget amounts long before we have the actual transfers to cover them.
I'm torn, but will likely take the I&E path.
I will comment that I think a lot of the confusion will be removed when 2011 starts. Next year we won't have pre-CUBS expenses and covering transfers to worry about. All these tricks are just ways to get the new system to show you the old information in the same detail you had it before. If you understand what CUBS has done and can finish off the year without needing the prior info in detail, there is no need to do most of what is explained here.