Temple donations and miss. deductions

Discuss questions around local unit policies for budgeting, reconciling, etc. This forum should not contain specific financial or membership information.
stott-p40
New Member
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:52 am

Temple donations and miss. deductions

Postby stott-p40 » Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:43 pm

2 quick questions here:

1. I am sure if I looked for a couple of hours I could find where it says what to do for a donation to a specific temple. Please give me the answer and save me some time.

2. I have one ward (I am the stake fin. clerk) that has a missionary out since Jan 09 and I do not see any missionary amt. deducted for him on the cufs. He did transfer from a BYU ward but he was called from his home ward and his records were transferred to his home ward. Has anyone seen that before? Where do we call to correct that? I assume he could not be called on his mission from our stake until his records were transferred.

russellhltn
Community Administrator
Posts: 20763
Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:53 pm
Location: U.S.

Postby russellhltn » Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:56 pm

stott wrote:I have one ward (I am the stake fin. clerk) that has a missionary out since Jan 09 and I do not see any missionary amt. deducted for him on the cufs. He did transfer from a BYU ward but he was called from his home ward and his records were transferred to his home ward. Has anyone seen that before? Where do we call to correct that? I assume he could not be called on his mission from our stake until his records were transferred.


Call clerk support. There's really not much of a connection between membership and finance. It might well be that his old BYU ward is paying it.

Out of curiosity, how is he being supported? His is family sending the check to a different ward? Or is he being "peer supported", in which case it might be best in the BYU ward.

Edit: While being supported by the "home ward" is the normal way, it's not the only way. As long as everyone is happy, there's nothing wrong with it.
Have you searched the Wiki?
Try using a Google search by adding "site:tech.lds.org/wiki" to the search criteria.

User avatar
mkmurray
Senior Member
Posts: 3241
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:56 pm
Location: Utah
Contact:

Postby mkmurray » Fri Sep 04, 2009 6:51 am

stott wrote:2. I have one ward (I am the stake fin. clerk) that has a missionary out since Jan 09 and I do not see any missionary amt. deducted for him on the cufs. He did transfer from a BYU ward but he was called from his home ward and his records were transferred to his home ward. Has anyone seen that before? Where do we call to correct that? I assume he could not be called on his mission from our stake until his records were transferred.

You don't see amounts deducted for any months in 2009, or just for July?

If you are only missing an amount for the July statement, this announcement from a Church employee could explain your confusion: http://tech.lds.org/forum/showthread.php?t=3460
Many questions are already answered on the LDSTech wiki. Check it out!

greggo
Member
Posts: 272
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:36 am
Location: Paw Paw, MI, USA

Postby greggo » Sat Sep 05, 2009 10:38 am

stott wrote:1. I am sure if I looked for a couple of hours I could find where it says what to do for a donation to a specific temple. Please give me the answer and save me some time.


If I remember correctly (someone correct me if I'm wrong), you process the donation as if for general temple construction and then cut a check to CHQ for the specific temple.

I actually never did one, but that is what I remember. We had one family that tried to donate to the Nauvoo temple construction, but we were in an overseas ward that didn't have checks - they ended up donating to a state-side ward to do it.

stott-p40
New Member
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:52 am

Postby stott-p40 » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:31 pm

To answer the above questions:
1. How is he being supported? He is not. I asked his mom if she knew why money was not being deducted from the cufs. She didn't know. They have not paid any money at all to his account since he left on his mission in Jan.
2. As far as how long have we not seen a deduction- since the first of his mission Jan 09.
3. Why has it not been caught? Not sure. The ward clerk was also doing the finances and wasn't paying attention. No one brought it up to the bishop or the parents. I asked the dad if he was aware of the situation and he said, "No problem. I am just waiting for some investments to mature before I send in some money." What? I didn't know we could do that.


Lessons learned: As stake finance clerks I would suggest that you ask your stake auditor to collect this information from each ward as he does the audits.
1. I&E Summary by category Jan 1 to end of audit period (This should match up with the cufs of the last month of the audit period.)
2. I&E Summary by subcategory Jan to end of audit period (This will let you see if the budget and other categories that should be zero are zero, and let's you see if the missionary and other accts. are OK.)
3. Ward budget report Jan to end of audit period (Lets you see if they are following a budget.)
4. Signature page of the last month being audited. (Lets you see if there are any adjustments that have been made to balance the cufs.)

These 4 items can let you see a lot of red flags.
This information will give you a great snapshot of how each ward stands.

stott-p40
New Member
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:52 am

Postby stott-p40 » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:37 pm

Greggo, if we deposit the donation under temple contruction, won't it automatically be transferred to Salt Lake, zeroing out that acct. similar to a donation to perpetual ed. fund? How can I write a check if that acct. will be automatically transferred?

We could only do what you are saying if we can deposit the donation in an acct. that will stay with the ward. Maybe Other:Temple (specific) would. Has anyone done this recently?

User avatar
aebrown
Community Administrator
Posts: 14693
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Sandy, Utah

Postby aebrown » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:48 pm

stott wrote:Greggo, if we deposit the donation under temple contruction, won't it automatically be transferred to Salt Lake, zeroing out that acct. similar to a donation to perpetual ed. fund? How can I write a check if that acct. will be automatically transferred?


You're right about Other:Temple Construction. Don't deposit money to that subcategory if the funds are intended for a specific temple, because any donation to Temple Construction is automatically swept.

stott wrote:We could only do what you are saying if we can deposit the donation in an acct. that will stay with the ward. Maybe Other:Temple (specific) would. Has anyone done this recently?


That's exactly what Other:Temple (specific) is for. See the wiki article Donation categories for details.

jdlessley
Community Moderators
Posts: 6526
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:30 pm
Location: USA, TX

Postby jdlessley » Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:39 pm

stott wrote:Lessons learned: As stake finance clerks I would suggest that you ask your stake auditor to collect this information from each ward as he does the audits.
While I can see your reason for saying this it is not the method to go about collecting this information. You will find that there will generally be more than one auditor performing audits. Stake auditors get their marching orders from the audit committee chairman and not the stake financial clerk. The function of an auditor is to perform an audit according to Church headquarters instructions and instructions from the audit committee chairman. Therefore stake finance clerks need to counsel with the audit committee chairman if procedures out of the normal duties of an auditor are to be requested.
JD Lessley
Have you tried finding your answer on the LDS.org Help Center page or the LDSTech wiki?

stott-p40
New Member
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:52 am

Postby stott-p40 » Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:49 pm

Hey, JD. I am not really asking the auditor to collect these reports as part of the audit. He (and we only have 1) gets them for me while he is there and the clerk can print them out easily. This gives me a great snapshot of how each ward's MLS is. Let's keep in mind, who is the one who has to follow up and try to fix any problems the auditor finds? It is the stake finance clerk. Also MLS problems exists that do not come out in the audit. In fact I am reviewing right now the reports that I requested above from each ward. I am finding other accts. that are carrying big negatives, Missionary accts. with big negatives, and temp. adjustments that have been carried over for months. My stake president has asked that I monitor these things. On the positive side I see that all my wards now have the proper balances, in other words I don't see positives and negatives in catagories that should be zeroed (like all the budget, pert. ed funds, templ construction, etc.). In the past after reviewing these reports we have found major accounting problems in some wards' MLS's. One elderly ward finance clerk (bless his heart) had gone back and and somehow made adjustments in past years numbers. That made the current year numbers off by tens of thousands. I would rather nip the problem in the bud before it gets too big.

Alan, thanks for the clarification on temple specific. That makes sense now.

jdlessley
Community Moderators
Posts: 6526
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:30 pm
Location: USA, TX

Postby jdlessley » Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:19 pm

stott, I can now see what you where getting at.

My following comments are not intended to be contrary but to point out to those who read these posts that there can be minor differences from stake to stake in how audits are done and how the audit process can help correct MLS practices or identify the training necessary to correct issues.
stott wrote:Let's keep in mind, who is the one who has to follow up and try to fix any problems the auditor finds? It is the stake finance clerk.
I agree the stake finance clerk is the one identified in the CHI to help ward finance clerks with day-to-day issues. After all the audits are complete the audits should be reviewed by the audit committee and an individual, or idividuals, assigned to followup, help correct the issues, and give necessary training. For our stake the stake clerk is not expected to do all the followup work. Rather other brethren with the necessary experience are asked to help to relieve the time and travel burden from the stake finance clerk. A properly functioning audit committee with inputs from the stake finance clerk will identify areas of financial records keeping practices that need attention both before and after an audit.

stott wrote:Also MLS problems exists that do not come out in the audit. In fact I am reviewing right now the reports that I requested above from each ward. I am finding other accts. that are carrying big negatives, Missionary accts. with big negatives, and temp. adjustments that have been carried over for months.
I agree there can be MLS issues that are not inspected during an audit using only the audit checklist. If there are issues not identified in the Church audit checklist that should be investigated or for which the auditor(s) could keep a watchful eye then the audit committee can identify those in the additional instructions given to the auditor(s) at the auditor training prior to each audit period. Of the three items you listed the temporary adjustments are specifically addressed in the audit (checklist items 32 & 33 and covered in more detail in the on-line training). The other two can be additional issues for the auditor(s) to be on the lookout for.

Negative balances, in the "Budget", "Missionary", and "Other" category are evident in the monthly stake financial summary. Investigating and identifying a corrective action plan for negative balances should be done before an audit.
JD Lessley
Have you tried finding your answer on the LDS.org Help Center page or the LDSTech wiki?


Return to “Local Unit Finance”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest