Using Budget instead of Other

[clund-p40]

Bretheren,

May I please remind you that when a member makes a deposit or payment to the church for an activity (i.e. scoutcamp) the member does not retain any ownership of the funds. The payment is given freely and may be used for the intended purpose (i.e. scoutcamp). If the unit does not use the contribution than it can be refunded back to the member. If the scout does not go on the activity the payment to the church can be refunded to the person since it wasn't a donation.

On page 156 of the handbook it states "When tithes and other offerings are given to the Church, they belong to the Lord, to whom they are consecrated. These offerings include all contributions to the ward and general missionary funds. The essence of all such contributions is that they are free-will offerings, made without reservation of purpose, retention of control, ownership in any form, or expectation of any benefit by the donor other than the Lord's blessings."

[jdlessley]

clund,

I think you are quite mistaken. Payments made to things such as Scout camp are neither tithes or offerings (charitable contributions). They are payments for tangible benefits. Your quotation of the information from the CHI on page 156 does not apply to tangible benefits since they are not charitable contributions.

More information on how to treat payments for tangible benefits can be found in the on-line lesson Understanding and Using the Other Category.

[jbh001]

(Sorry if this is duplicate information, but I can't access the training link in the other post because the current computer I'm on won't display that page, and neither will my iPhone. Here is an alternative link that doesn't require Adobe Flash, but does require a PDF reader. http://www.lds.org/pa/e-learn/mp/other2 ... _Print.pdf)

The whole purpose of the "other" account is for convenience. Specifically, so that one check can be written for scout camp (YW camp, etc.) instead of sending a batch of personal checks. These are called "pass-through" funds because they just happen to pass through the Church during their handling, but they are not considered tithes or offerings, nor are they treated as such.

The CHI is mute (as far as I can determine) regarding how to use the "Other" category, but MLS is rather clear. The help file in MLS states the following:

MLS Help
Financial Policies
Donation Categories
Other - The Other category is used for pass-through funds for specific services and commodities related to Church membership, such as money for a youth camp or for the purchase of Church magazines. Funds contributed to the Other category are not considered charitable contributions and will not appear on the member's annual tax-valid statement.

MLS Help
Financial Policies
Using the "Other" Category
The "Other" category of your checking account is used for pass-through funds, those generally raised or collected to pay for goods or services. Examples are Church magazines or girls' camp. These funds are deposited and then disbursed by check. Most pass through quickly, although some may accumulate if they are earmarked for a future activity. Funds collected and not used should be returned to the donors. If funds in the "Other" category go to a negative balance, use budget funds to bring the balance back to zero.

[ssrail-p40]

Just another piece of information about the relationship between "Budget" and "Other." The online help in MLS says:

What if the wall between Budget and Other was dropped? What is this! Based on my understanding of Accounting principles a batch is a batch meaning that each line should have a number assign to it for tracking, and that way a check could be writing from both sides of an account, for example this would be like having two checking accounts and you writing a check to yourself from the same account. you should be able to have separate batches. Maybe the MLS should do the same.

The Main Problem is (Example) the Bishop uses a credit card or personal check to help lodge a member for a night or two which comes from Fast Offeringsand also buys books and candy for the office which comes from Bishops Reserve then on a camp out with the scouts needs to buy some extra supplies for the Scouts that comes out of Other Scout camp funds. Because of the way the MLS is setup as many a Three checks would have to be written and every check will then need to be tracked in stead on writing only one check to the payee. This is the worst case situation but its happened.

That's it Maybe where could be a way to fix this some day

Thanks

[rexgj]

You mean it's possible to deposit "income" money into budget? I'm kind of shocked by this; 1) didn't know it was possible, and 2) if it is possible, then what's the point of the budget allowance? Wards can just go out and "earn" all the money they want and throw it into the budget, pretending it all came from the budget allowance. I'm confused.

[jdlessley]

You mean it's possible to deposit "income" money into budget?

What do you mean by "income" money?

No funds other than return of advances should be deposited into any budget account (CHI, book 1, p 159-161) (Budget Allowance). The ability to deposit funds into any budget account is to permit an excess advance disbursement to be returned or redeposited into the account from which the disbursement was made. (See the Handling Church Expensestraining lesson, p 23)

I'm kind of shocked by this; 1) didn't know it was possible, and 2) if it is possible, then what's the point of the budget allowance?

As stated above, the ability to deposit funds into the budget account is to permit return of excess disbursements. It is not for any other purpose, except as directed by Church headquarters. The ability to make deposits into a budget account does not obviate the budget allowance. Church policies and procedures must be followed when dealing with the budget allowance. No contributions may be deposited into any budget account.

Wards can just go out and "earn" all the money they want and throw it into the budget, pretending it all came from the budget allowance.

To do this would be a violation of Church policy. While this practice may go undetected or challenged for a period of time, eventually either by local audit or by Church headquarters audit, the discrepancy would be detected and appropriate measures taken.

[rexgj]

Maybe I don't understand what's being discussed here. I used the term "income" money to refer to money be raised, earned, fundraisers--money that does not come from the budget allowance. That's why I'm unclear about depositing money into the budget. I didn't know that was possible, let alone that it was permissible. And I had thought that "excess disbursement" funds went into the "Other" account, not budget.

[aebrown]

Maybe I don't understand what's being discussed here. I used the term "income" money to refer to money be raised, earned, fundraisers--money that does not come from the budget allowance. That's why I'm unclear about depositing money into the budget. I didn't know that was possible, let alone that it was permissible. And I had thought that "excess disbursement" funds went into the "Other" account, not budget.

I'm not sure what you are talking about. This thread has more than 40 posts, so it would help if you would link to or quote from the post you have concerns about.

As jdslessley explained, the term "income" as used in MLS simply refers to deposits, which can indeed be done under policy to the Budget category for limited, specific reasons. There's no reason to conclude that such deposits are necessarily a violation of policy, but if you would like clarification, please let us know just what post you are talking about.

[jdlessley]

I used the term "income" money to refer to money be raised, earned, fundraisers--money that does not come from the budget allowance.

Fund-raisers have very limited circumstances in which they may be used. Fund-raisers are only for annual summer camps and equipment as outlined in the CHI, book 1, page 160-161. The funds from any fund-raiser should only be deposited into an Other sub account in accordance with Church policy and procedure. Any discussions in this or any other thread stating that this may be done is in opposition to Church policy and procedure. Because MLS permits funds from fund-raisers to be deposited into any budget account does not mean it is a proper procedure. Some users in this thread were proposing depositing donations or fund-raiser funds into the budget as a shortcut for situations where budget monies were insuficiient to cover the costs of the camp(s) and to avoid having to write two checks. This is ill advised since it is in opposition to Church policy and procedure.

I had thought that "excess disbursement" funds went into the "Other" account, not budget.

When a member recieves an advance disbursement for expenses and then returns a part of that advance as an excess disbursement the funds are redeposited into the budget account from which they were disbursed. The reason why some people get confused as to where the leftover funds are actually to be deposited is because the procedure to return leftover funds is to cross out 'Other' on the Tithing and Other Offerings slip and write in 'Budget Return'. The funds are not actually being deposited into the Other account. The only place on the Tithing and Other Offerings slip to annotate the budget return is in the "Other' category. The clerk actually returns the leftover funds into the budget account from which the funds came.