Negative budget balance

Discuss questions around local unit policies for budgeting, reconciling, etc. This forum should not contain specific financial or membership information.
drepouille
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Negative budget balance

Postby drepouille » Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:48 am

I just received this question from a ward clerk. How would you respond?

"ward has a negative balance in the budget. Can we transfer funds from the ward missionary account to cover this."
Dana Repouille, Plattsmouth, Nebraska

allenjpl
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby allenjpl » Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:39 am

Unless you are referring to a subcategory within the Budget that was set up for expense associated with the ward missionary program, the answer is no. Handbook 1, 14.4.4 expressly says that Ward Missionary funds are used to support full-time missionaries, and can't be used for anything else.

drepouille
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby drepouille » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:44 am

Thanks for that reply.

The bishop says:
Even with the quarterly deposit we are still almost $600 over budget YTD. If we spent virtually nothing (unlikely) we may get caught up by the Fall.

The question was whether or not we are allowed to transfer funds from excess fast Offerings or Excess Missionary funds to cover budget.
Dana Repouille, Plattsmouth, Nebraska

eblood66
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby eblood66 » Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:18 am

drepouille wrote:Thanks for that reply.

The bishop says:
Even with the quarterly deposit we are still almost $600 over budget YTD. If we spent virtually nothing (unlikely) we may get caught up by the Fall.

The question was whether or not we are allowed to transfer funds from excess fast Offerings or Excess Missionary funds to cover budget.


See Handbook 1 section 14.4.3 (about Ward Missionary funds) and section 5.2.4 (about Fast Offerings). Neither section allows for these funds to be used for ward budget needs.

The stake can help out if they have sufficient stake budget funds. Other than that I don't know of any solution other than for the ward to stop spending.

drepouille
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby drepouille » Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:32 pm

Maybe they could print money?

Seriously, the ward had a $400 Staples bill for toner in December, and ended with minus $1400 at the end of the year. They received $900 last week for their quarterly budget disbursement.

The stake bailed them out once before. Let's see what happens this time.
Thanks
Dana Repouille, Plattsmouth, Nebraska

lajackson
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby lajackson » Sun Jan 20, 2013 4:28 pm

drepouille wrote:Maybe they could print money?

Haven't found that MLS option yet, either! [grin]

drepouille wrote:The stake bailed them out once before. Let's see what happens this time.

Actually, it sounds as if it is time for the stake to provide the ward some training on how budgeting and the budget allocation system works. Whether that would be stake clerk to ward clerk, or stake president to bishop, it appears there is a need, and this is a good time of the year to do it as they plan ahead for 2013.

Gary_Miller
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby Gary_Miller » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:01 pm

It sounds as if its time for the bishop to get more familiar with the Handbooks.

russellhltn
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby russellhltn » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:15 pm

Given that the bishop must approve each expense, that either means he hasn't been getting the needed support from the clerks as to how much money the ward has, or he's be authorizing payments when there is no funds. Either way, there's a FUNDamental breakdown in the process. Given this is then second time, I suspect the stake's intervention isn't going to be pretty.
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drepouille
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby drepouille » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:55 pm

russellhltn wrote:Given that the bishop must approve each expense, that either means he hasn't been getting the needed support from the clerks as to how much money the ward has, or he's be authorizing payments when there is no funds. Either way, there's a FUNDamental breakdown in the process. Given this is then second time, I suspect the stake's intervention isn't going to be pretty.


As I understand it, the first intervention was when the ward's Other account went negative, and they needed help. While I was there today, I reviewed their recent expenditures. Most of them were Fast Offering. There was also a recurring expense for gasoline for a "church van". I don't want to know.
Dana Repouille, Plattsmouth, Nebraska

russellhltn
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Re: Negative budget balance

Postby russellhltn » Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:02 pm

drepouille wrote:As I understand it, the first intervention was when the ward's Other account went negative, and they needed help.


That may be related. In fact that might be where their budget went - zeroing out the "Other".


drepouille wrote:While I was there today, I reviewed their recent expenditures. Most of them were Fast Offering.


That might raise a different issue, but shouldn't make the budget go negative.


drepouille wrote:There was also a recurring expense for gasoline for a "church van". I don't want to know.


Excuse me while I put some popcorn in the microwave. Shall I toss in a extra bag for you?
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