Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

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tubaloth
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Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby tubaloth » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:49 pm

I guess we kind of learned the hard way that we should put money in the Other funds and take out money from the budget.
This is for Scout Camp (and YW Camp)
We set up a budget and start to pay off camp expenses with it. The fundraiser they did we put the money in the other account.

Now that everything is over, do we write a check from the other to the Camp fund?
Do we just write the check for the full amount that is in other and just give it to the camp budget fund? Or do just pay it off and put the rest towards the general budget?

We know have extra money from the camp fundraiser. Do we give that money to the YM? To the Scouting fund or just pay them off and let the ward budget keep the leftover?

Thanks

eblood66
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby eblood66 » Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:39 pm

tubaloth wrote:I guess we kind of learned the hard way that we should put money in the Other funds and take out money from the budget.
This is for Scout Camp (and YW Camp)
We set up a budget and start to pay off camp expenses with it. The fundraiser they did we put the money in the other account.

Now that everything is over, do we write a check from the other to the Camp fund?

Personally, I prefer to find appropriate expenses and change the category. This makes it obvious that the Other funds were used for the intended purpose.

tubaloth wrote:Do we just write the check for the full amount that is in other and just give it to the camp budget fund? Or do just pay it off and put the rest towards the general budget?

We know have extra money from the camp fundraiser. Do we give that money to the YM? To the Scouting fund or just pay them off and let the ward budget keep the leftover?

Thanks

You must use Other funds only for the purpose they were originally donated for. So, no, they can't go into the scouting fund (unless the fundraiser was a joint fundraiser for both YW and YM) and they can't go into the ward budget.

If the funds were paid by the YW themselves you should refund the excess back to those who paid. But if the funds came from a fundraiser where the money came from others then that isn't an option. In that case you can use the funds to purchase needed camp equipment, if there is anything you need. Otherwise the funds will probably have to be retained until the next year. This should generally be avoided but is better than using the funds for a different purpose.

There is an RKATS article (under Finance/Donations if I remember correctly) named "The 'Other' Account" (or something similar) which describes in detail rules that should be followed for handling Other account funds.

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aebrown
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby aebrown » Fri Jul 18, 2014 8:03 pm

eblood66 wrote:There is an RKATS article (under Finance/Donations if I remember correctly) named "The 'Other' Account" (or something similar) which describes in detail rules that should be followed for handling Other account funds.

It's The "Other" Category (click on the link to go directly to the article, if you are signed in to LDS.org and have appropriate permissions).

tubaloth
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby tubaloth » Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:20 am

I guess I'm still having problems with this. Correct me if I'm wrong.
1. Expenses/Checks for Scouting (or YM Camp) related stuff are written from the budget.
(Not sure if this should come from the YM and YW budget? More on this below)
2. We then pay the ward back with the stuff in the Other budget? (I think this is correct)

3. Should the leftover money in the other account go to the ward budget, or just left in the other account?
In our audit they keep saying we should try to zero out our other funds as soon as we can. But it sounds like we should leave the extra money (from Fundraisers) in the other account not in some scouting budget? Right?


About budgets
Do wards set up a budget for scouting? So for like merit badges, or Court of Honors. Currently our ward just has a YM budget, and a sub budget for scouts (but no money has been given to that budget). I then moved over all the other funds to the scouts budget... which we have then be using to pay for merit badges. I am thinking that is wrong.

I know primary has a cub scout budget I think...
So was this set up wrong, and we should have given money to both YM and Scouts?
Maybe I should keep the Scout Budget at 0. Meaning we write checks from the Scout budget and go into the whole. After scouts is over we 0 that back out with the other funds? (assuming people can get there receipts in on time).

We also have the same problem with paying for strange stuff like lunch for a Funeral. What budget do you take that out of?

eblood66
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby eblood66 » Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:01 am

tubaloth wrote:I guess I'm still having problems with this. Correct me if I'm wrong.
1. Expenses/Checks for Scouting (or YM Camp) related stuff are written from the budget.
(Not sure if this should come from the YM and YW budget? More on this below)

Expenses for scout camp should be paid from the Other account first. If the expenses for the scout camp exceed the funds in the Other account then budget funds should be used. If Other account funds come in after an expense was paid out of the budget, you should go back and edit the expense and change the category so that they come out of the Other account.

tubaloth wrote:2. We then pay the ward back with the stuff in the Other budget? (I think this is correct)

You can do that but personally I think it is bad practice. It's better to pay directly from the Other account or adjust the category of an expense (or part of an expense) after the fact. This is better because it keeps track of exactly which expenses were paid using Other funds so that you can make sure they are all appropriate.

tubaloth wrote:3. Should the leftover money in the other account go to the ward budget, or just left in the other account?
In our audit they keep saying we should try to zero out our other funds as soon as we can. But it sounds like we should leave the extra money (from Fundraisers) in the other account not in some scouting budget? Right?

That's right. You can't take extra funds from the other account and just move it to the budget. You should try to spend those funds on appropriate scout camp expenses (including equipment). If that's not possible then the money needs to stay there and be used for the next years scout camp. The Young Men's organization should try not to raise more money than is needed. That way you can actually zero the accounts like the auditor wants.

tubaloth wrote:About budgets
Do wards set up a budget for scouting? So for like merit badges, or Court of Honors. Currently our ward just has a YM budget, and a sub budget for scouts (but no money has been given to that budget).

This kind of thing is handled differently in each ward. If you want you can have a single YM budget and pay for everything out of that budget. Or you can divide things out and put some in the YM budget and some in the Scout sub-catetory and pay expenses from each depending on the expense. Whatever helps you and the bishop and the YM's organization manage the budget best.

tubaloth wrote:I then moved over all the other funds to the scouts budget... which we have then be using to pay for merit badges. I am thinking that is wrong.

No, Other account funds can't be used to pay for merit badges so you shouldn't move other account funds into the scouts budget. The Other account funds can only be used for scout camp.

tubaloth wrote:We also have the same problem with paying for strange stuff like lunch for a Funeral. What budget do you take that out of?

That's up to you and your bishop. How to allocate the overall budget funds between sub-categories and then which sub-category to use for a given expense is pretty much entirely up to the ward as long as the expenses are appropriate for the budget. You can set up a sub-category for Funerals or for Misc and use that or you can just use the Bishopric or Relief Society budget and include enough from the overall budget in one of these to cover these expenses. Circumstances vary and what works for one ward doesn't always work for the next.

tubaloth
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby tubaloth » Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:14 am

Yeah so I guess I need to write two checks again and put the money back into Other. (on for the Scouts, and one for YM camp).
I don't know why I thought taking all the money out was the right thing. Leaving in other does seem like its the best place for those funds.

russellhltn
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Re: Zero out Other Funds -- Where does the extra go?

Postby russellhltn » Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:40 pm

The underlying principle is that you can't use "other" to supplement the budget. The "other" funds have to be spent on purpose they were collected for. While it's not necessarily wrong to transfer "other" to budget to pay those bills, it does give the appearance of wrong-doing and requires more examination to verify that the principle rules have been met. Therefore it is not best practice.

It's much better to transfer any expenses so in the end the other account shows all the money collected and what it was spent on without without commingling with the YM/YW non-camp budget.

You can always transfer from budget to other if that's what's needed to zero things out. There's no "appearance" problem with that. The Handbook covers what to do with any excess in other.
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