Move the recording of Melchizedek Priesthood Advancements to the stake level

Discussions around using and interfacing with the Church MLS program.
russellhltn
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Postby russellhltn » Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:22 pm

unixguy wrote:The only downside is not always knowing in advance what calling the stake representative will have, to put on the form.


:confused: You mean who will be doing the actual ordination in advance?

unixguy
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Postby unixguy » Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:15 pm

RussellHltn wrote::confused: You mean who will be doing the actual ordination in advance?

No, when you fill out the certificate, there's a blank field labeled "calling of the Stake representative" (or something like that). If it's a member of the HC who is there, then we fill in "High Councillor". if it's a member of the Stake Presidency, then we put their calling into the field. (Hmm, wonder if the form handles the situation properly where the Stake President is there, so there isn't any other stake representative. Two signatures from the Stake Pres?)

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Postby james_francisco » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:56 am

That is what we had our stake president do in a couple of occasions where he was the stake leader present at the ordination.


unixguy wrote:No, when you fill out the certificate, there's a blank field labeled "calling of the Stake representative" (or something like that). If it's a member of the HC who is there, then we fill in "High Councillor". if it's a member of the Stake Presidency, then we put their calling into the field. (Hmm, wonder if the form handles the situation properly where the Stake President is there, so there isn't any other stake representative. Two signatures from the Stake Pres?)

wasatchpowder-p40
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Postby wasatchpowder-p40 » Tue Feb 19, 2008 2:33 pm

I consider the most important aspect of the MPH ordination is that it be recorded.
If it's not recorded then it is as if the ordination never took place.

Therefore, it is our responsibility as stake clerks to facilitate this action as efficiently as we can.
Whatever procedure is implemented in your stake, it should accomplish three things. The member is properly ordained, the ordination properly recorded and a certificate is delivered to the member in a timely fashion.

The procedure I choose to use that has worked well in my stake follows.

We continue to use the two part pre-printed MPH ordination forms that contain the member information on the top half and the certificate on the bottom half.

The bishop interviews the prospective elder, fills out the upper portion of the form, and signs it.
He then sends the form to the stake president.
The stake president interviews, completes the top portion and signs the certificate.
The stake president gives me the form, which now contains the information regarding when the ordination will take place and who will be performing the ordination. Plus, he informs me who will officiate.
I print up the certificate on my laser printer via a C++ program that I wrote that properly formats output on the form.
I give the completed form to the high councilor, he officiates the ordination, and hands the completed certificate to the member. He leaves the yellow copy of the form/certificate with the ward clerk.
I email the ward clerk to make sure that he is aware the ordination took place just in case the yellow copy does not get left with the clerk.

I do not use the certificate printing option in MLS because I regard the certificates created in MLS to look less than steller and do not magnify the importance of the ordination. Just personal preference. All of my ward clerks use my program for printing blessings, baptisms, and APH ordinations.

The key for me is that it is a lot easier to have the certificate printed and available before the ordination than to try and reconstruct everything after the fact.

Dave

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Postby benl64usa-p40 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:50 am

I'm an Assistant Stake Clerk. I found that the easiest way I found to ensure the ordinations are being recorded is to send an MLS message within 1 week to the unit where the record resides. I make sure it has all of the necessary information that's required to have the member's record updated properly.

I also keep a check list to record when the ordination actually shows as being recorded on the Member's Record. If I don't see something within a month, I resend the information and confirm by phone that they received the MLS message.

I still print off the Ordination Certificate in MLS at the Stake Level and then send it off to the Ward/Branch. That part usually takes about 2-4 weeks to get to the Member since the Stake Center is about an hour away from where I live.

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Jimmer-p40
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Postby Jimmer-p40 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:40 am

I print up the certificate on my laser printer via a C++ program that I wrote that properly formats output on the form.
I give the completed form to the high councilor, he officiates the ordination, and hands the completed certificate to the member. He leaves the yellow copy of the form/certificate with the ward clerk.
I email the ward clerk to make sure that he is aware the ordination took place just in case the yellow copy does not get left with the clerk.

I do not use the certificate printing option in MLS because I regard the certificates created in MLS to look less than steller and do not magnify the importance of the ordination. Just personal preference. All of my ward clerks use my program for printing blessings, baptisms, and APH ordinations.

One thing that we really shouldn't forget is that while the certificates are not very flashy in MLS, they are a standard certificate that has an "authorized" church logo on it. It also is the only valid certificte that we are able to use should we ever need to prove our priesthood for something like an out of town ordination, or in the case where your ordination was recorded improperly or not at all.

While you can provide a paper to someone that has all of the same information on it as a certificate so that they can make a scrap book page, I would give them the certificate that the Brotheren have accepted as the standard through MLS.

Just another note, is your c++ program on your personal computer or is it on the clerk computer? make sure that you don't retain any membership information on your computer that is not properly safeguarded.

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Jimmer-p40
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Postby Jimmer-p40 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:44 am

wasatchpowder wrote:I consider the most important aspect of the MPH ordination is that it be recorded.
If it's not recorded then it is as if the ordination never took place.

Therefore, it is our responsibility as stake clerks to facilitate this action as efficiently as we can.
Whatever procedure is implemented in your stake, it should accomplish three things. The member is properly ordained, the ordination properly recorded and a certificate is delivered to the member in a timely fashion.

The procedure I choose to use that has worked well in my stake follows.

We continue to use the two part pre-printed MPH ordination forms that contain the member information on the top half and the certificate on the bottom half.

The bishop interviews the prospective elder, fills out the upper portion of the form, and signs it.
He then sends the form to the stake president.
The stake president interviews, completes the top portion and signs the certificate.
The stake president gives me the form, which now contains the information regarding when the ordination will take place and who will be performing the ordination. Plus, he informs me who will officiate.
I print up the certificate on my laser printer via a C++ program that I wrote that properly formats output on the form.
I give the completed form to the high councilor, he officiates the ordination, and hands the completed certificate to the member. He leaves the yellow copy of the form/certificate with the ward clerk.
I email the ward clerk to make sure that he is aware the ordination took place just in case the yellow copy does not get left with the clerk.

I do not use the certificate printing option in MLS because I regard the certificates created in MLS to look less than steller and do not magnify the importance of the ordination. Just personal preference. All of my ward clerks use my program for printing blessings, baptisms, and APH ordinations.

The key for me is that it is a lot easier to have the certificate printed and available before the ordination than to try and reconstruct everything after the fact.

Dave

One thing that we really shouldn't forget is that while the certificates are not very flashy in MLS, they are a standard certificate that has an "authorized" church logo on it. It also is the only valid certificte that we are able to use should we ever need to prove our priesthood for something like an out of town ordination, or in the case where your ordination was recorded improperly or not at all.

While you can provide a paper to someone that has all of the same information on it as a certificate so that they can make a scrap book page, I would give them the certificate that the Brotheren have accepted as the standard through MLS.

Just another note, is your c++ program on your personal computer or is it on the clerk computer? make sure that you don't retain any membership information on your computer that is not properly safeguarded.

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Print certificates from MLS

Postby danpass » Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:20 pm

Jimmer wrote:One thing that we really shouldn't forget is that while the certificates are not very flashy in MLS, they are a standard certificate that has an "authorized" church logo on it. It also is the only valid certificte that we are able to use should we ever need to prove our priesthood for something like an out of town ordination, or in the case where your ordination was recorded improperly or not at all.


We've found that printed certificates from MLS actually look quite nice if printed on parchment style paper. Most office supply stores carry it.

dennismgreene-p40
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Postby dennismgreene-p40 » Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:46 pm

I am currently a Stake Clerk, but I have also been a Ward Membership Clerk in the past. In the old MIS System both the ward and the stake could record Melchizedek Priesthood ordinations. It would take the Stake Clerk a long time to get it done, because they have a lot on their plate. So I would always record the ordinances as soon as the happened. Now that I am the Stake Clerk, I am a bit frustrated because the Ward Clerks have a lot on their plate and don't get them recorded in a timely fashion. In our stake we have instituted a policy of having two sets of the ordination record follow the process. Once the ordination is complete, one copy is given to the ward clerk and the other to the stake clerk. I then track the status of ordinations on a "name/action" list.

I believe that it may be a matter of teaching the principles:

Clerks and members have a sacred and important responsibility to make sure ordinances and other information are accurately recorded on the permanent records of the Church. Even though an ordinance has been approved by those with the proper keys and performed by the proper authority, it is not valid unless it is properly recorded. “Whatsoever you do not record on earth shall not be recorded in heaven.” D&C 128:8

I guess it doesn't matter who records it as long as it is recorded. I have sent a suggestion via MLS requesting that the stake also has the ability to record the ordinance.

wasatchpowder-p40
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Postby wasatchpowder-p40 » Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:48 pm

Jimmer,

I am using the official Church ordination forms available from the distribution center and my C++ program does not store any information. It just allows for typing in all the information and printing it in the correct spot on the certificate.

I believe the newest version of the old ordination forms now has a comment on them indicating for use for units without MLS.


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