Please forward to whom it may concern

Discussions about the Leader and Clerk Resources on lds.org.
rogersp
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Please forward to whom it may concern

Postby rogersp » Sun Apr 03, 2011 4:32 pm

I have been looking for 30+ minutes and can find no logical place to ask this question. So, assuming my newbie post won't simply be cast into outer darkness, please pass along to whomever should know this:

About a month ago, we received two records into our ward. When using Leader and Clerk Resources on lds.org, selecting menu items Organizations | Out of unit callings, these two members are listed along with callings they had in their previous wards.

While this information would be useful for the bishopric, on all incoming records, none of the 15 records that have come since reveal any such information about those members--though it is not unlikely they have never had any callings (though one was a temple president back in the early 1990's).

So, is this a glitch, or a new feature?

I sent a message via the MLS messaging system about this. Their response was that they didn't understand what I was talking about and to please call CHQ.

If someone knows, or can give me an email address of someone who will, please PM me.

thanks

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:09 pm

rogersp wrote:I have been looking for 30+ minutes and can find no logical place to ask this question. So, assuming my newbie post won't simply be cast into outer darkness, please pass along to whomever should know this:


It won't get cast into outer darkness, but I've moved it to a more appropriate forum.

rogersp wrote:About a month ago, we received two records into our ward. When using Leader and Clerk Resources on lds.org, selecting menu items Organizations | Out of unit callings, these two members are listed along with callings they had in their previous wards.

While this information would be useful for the bishopric, on all incoming records, none of the 15 records that have come since reveal any such information about those members--though it is not unlikely they have never had any callings (though one was a temple president back in the early 1990's).

So, is this a glitch, or a new feature?


I'm quite sure that there is no intention to show previous callings (at least at this point) on that screen. Rather, this is a bit of a glitch related to out-of-unit callings. You could ask the members in question to be sure, but I would bet that the callings that are listed are not simply the callings they last had in their ward, but rather they had some sort of calling in a ward other than their home ward.

There was an obliquely related situation reported in the thread Event notification received by former out-of-unit member. That seems to indicate that callings for members who have out of unit callings don't get cleaned up simply because they move out of a ward. That makes some sense; since an out-of-unit calling is not connected to your current ward, just because you move out of your ward doesn't mean you got released from that calling.

There is a hypothesis in that thread (never verified) that once the member is removed from the out-of-unit calling by the ward or stake that issued that calling, the out-of-unit calling will disappear on the records of the ward that now has their records.
Questions that can benefit the larger community should be asked in a public forum, not a private message.

rogersp
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Postby rogersp » Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:14 am

aebrown wrote:It won't get cast into outer darkness, but I've moved it to a more appropriate forum.



I'm quite sure that there is no intention to show previous callings (at least at this point) on that screen. Rather, this is a bit of a glitch related to out-of-unit callings. You could ask the members in question to be sure, but I would bet that the callings that are listed are not simply the callings they last had in their ward, but rather they had some sort of calling in a ward other than their home ward.

There was an obliquely related situation reported in the thread Event notification received by former out-of-unit member. That seems to indicate that callings for members who have out of unit callings don't get cleaned up simply because they move out of a ward. That makes some sense; since an out-of-unit calling is not connected to your current ward, just because you move out of your ward doesn't mean you got released from that calling.

There is a hypothesis in that thread (never verified) that once the member is removed from the out-of-unit calling by the ward or stake that issued that calling, the out-of-unit calling will disappear on the records of the ward that now has their records.


Thanks for moving the post, and for the hypothesis. However, I know for a fact (since I was also the membership clerk in that ward) that one of the two member's callings was for and in the ward where she lived. So, this is still a glitch, but with likely a more problematic origin.

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:37 am

rogersp wrote:However, I know for a fact (since I was also the membership clerk in that ward) that one of the two member's callings was for and in the ward where she lived. So, this is still a glitch, but with likely a more problematic origin.


That's interesting that you were the membership clerk in one of the wards. So was this a move within the stake? Or is a stake or ward realignment or creation a factor? There have been some issues reported related to callings with those situations.

In any case, an out of unit calling is supposed to refer only to a calling in another unit that a member currently has. If somehow a member moves and still is connected to a calling in the previous ward, then by definition, that is now an out of unit calling. Of course, the important question is why a member who moved out of a ward didn't automatically get disconnected from a ward calling.

rogersp wrote:I sent a message via the MLS messaging system about this. Their response was that they didn't understand what I was talking about and to please call CHQ.

If someone knows, or can give me an email address of someone who will, please PM me.


AFAIK, the same people who answer the phone for Local Unit Support answer the MLS messages and email as well. But on the phone you can follow up better in an interactive dialogue, so that's probably your best option for an issue such as this.
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Postby jonesrk » Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:50 am

rogersp wrote:About a month ago, we received two records into our ward. When using Leader and Clerk Resources on lds.org, selecting menu items Organizations | Out of unit callings, these two members are listed along with callings they had in their previous wards.

So, is this a glitch, or a new feature?


It is not really either. It is a result of MLS being a disconnected system and the Leader and Clerk Resources being online and querying the headquarters versions. Those callings hadn't been released in their old ward's MLS and the changes sent up to CDOL. But the membership records had moved to the new ward at CHQ. So they showed in your ward in the leader app. The leader app then queries CDOL for all the callings a person has (to show their valid out of unit callings - like stake positions, singles ward bishop, etc). Until their old home ward gets the move request, automatically releases them and sends those changes to CDOL, they will show up with the old calling.
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Postby RossEvans » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:09 am

JonesRK wrote:Until their old home ward gets the move request, automatically releases them and sends those changes to CDOL, they will show up with the old calling.


So the old ward MLS system has not done a send/receive in over a month?

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Postby jonesrk » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:23 am

RossEvans wrote:So the old ward MLS system has not done a send/receive in over a month?

I appears that I missed that small :) detail. That is one possibility. The other is that somehow the automatic release failed in MLS or in the communication to CDOL.
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