Different Time Zone issue

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RBeatse
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Different Time Zone issue

Postby RBeatse » Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:14 am

I schedule the buildings for our Stake and I travel a good amount for work. This past week, I was in Kansas City (I live in Salt Lake) and had a few people call with some events that needed to be added to the calendar. I did them then when I got home yesterday, I realized that all of them moved up one hour.

For example, I scheduled an event from 5PM-7PM but the calendar not showed it from 4PM-6PM. I was able to change it easily enough but, I believe, it took the time/time zone for where I was at the time (Central Time) and adjusted it to Mountain Time. Maybe when the Locations are created, they should have a time zone and it shouldn't matter where the person is that is creating the event, the time scheduled should match the time zone where the event is to take place.

If it matters, I was using my iPad and a browser to create the event.

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:15 pm

This has been discussed previously; see, for example, this post and a few that follow it. I think if you read the explanations in that thread, you'll see that it's working properly (and, indeed, the only way that it reasonably can work) as it adjusts the times for events to correspond to the time zone of the device you are using to view the calendar.
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RBeatse
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Postby RBeatse » Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:15 am

aebrown wrote:I think if you read the explanations in that thread, you'll see that it's working properly (and, indeed, the only way that it reasonably can work)


I read the other post and I guess I am going to have to respectfully disagree about it being the only way it can reasonably work. Here is how I believe it should work:
* Each Location is assigned to a time zone (the time zone of the physical building)
* When a person schedules an event, they are choosing the time that they want the event in the location where the building is on the date that they schedule it for (they don't worry that something like Daylight Savings might have kicked in by then).
* The system stores that time in UTC, no problem there
* When someone views the event, you can show them it based on the time on their device

So, in this way, if my home building is in Los Angeles and I am sitting in New York: I schedule an event for December 26, 2012 at 7PM at my building (7 PM Pacific Time). The system stores it as December 27, 2012 at 3AM (UTC time). Once I have saved it, if I look at my device it may say that the event starts on December 26, 2012 at 10 PM (Easten time). When I get home, it will say that the event starts at December 26, 2012 at 7PM.

Right now, the original scheduling is being based on where the original person is, but you are scheduling an entire location (or at least a room). That just seems wrong to me, but I am just one person.

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:58 am

RBeatse wrote:So, in this way, if my home building is in Los Angeles and I am sitting in New York: I schedule an event for December 26, 2012 at 7PM at my building (7 PM Pacific Time). The system stores it as December 27, 2012 at 3AM (UTC time). Once I have saved it, if I look at my device it may say that the event starts on December 26, 2012 at 10 PM (Easten time). When I get home, it will say that the event starts at December 26, 2012 at 7PM.


Mixing one time zone used for entering events with a different time zone used for displaying events seems hopelessly confusing. Under your proposal, you'd be looking at all sorts of existing events, all adjusted to the time zone your device is currently using. Then you add a new event that fits in with those events, but you specify that event in the time zone of the building, only to find that when you save it, the time suddenly adjusts to be in the time zone of the device.

To give an example, I want to schedule a meeting that starts one hour before my block that is at 9:00am PST. I am in EST, so my block appears as noon EST. So I have to think of my new event as being at 8:00am PST, even though it is one hour before the event that appears at noon on the calendar I'm looking at right now. So I figure that out and create an 8:00am event. I save it, and it is immediately displayed as 11:00am (PST). I edit it, and it appears as 8:00 again. I don't see how mixing time zones can work at all.
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Postby russellhltn » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:06 am

RBeatse wrote:I read the other post and I guess I am going to have to respectfully disagree about it being the only way it can reasonably work. Here is how I believe it should work:
* Each Location is assigned to a time zone (the time zone of the physical building)
* When a person schedules an event, they are choosing the time that they want the event in the location where the building is on the date that they schedule it for (they don't worry that something like Daylight Savings might have kicked in by then).
* The system stores that time in UTC, no problem there
* When someone views the event, you can show them it based on the time on their device


I disagree with your last point. And I would make one change - each ward and stake is assigned a time zone. The reason for this is to deal with locationless events. But all events are based on the unit time zone, regardless of what time zone the viewer is located in.

I find it difficult to belive that people think in terms of "thier local zone" and not "the ward's time zone" when looking at events.
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RBeatse
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Postby RBeatse » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:13 am

I see the problem but I don't think it is any more onnerous than having it the other way. In your example, your block starts at 9 AM and someone calls you top schedule something at 8 AM. You schedule it at 8 AM but to the whole Ward, it looks like ti is at 5 AM, just because your phone is set to Eastern time.

I don't know...It just seems like there better way. I know that for work, eveyone else isn't affected because I happen to be in a different tiome zone when I scheduled a mtg. There needs to be a constant and I would think that it should always be the building time zone. I schedule things base don the building's time zone...not based on where I happen to be at the moment. Maybe the best could be some kind of notification that shows the time at the building for whatever you are scheduling so that these things don't get confused but maybe that is only a problem for a very small group of us and I'll get over it.

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Postby lajackson » Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:30 am

RussellHltn wrote:I would make one change - each ward and stake is assigned a time zone.


I have not lived in a ward that covered two time zones, but I have lived in a stake that covers two time zones. I think the assignment would have to be by building, not by ward/stake.

(And to make it even worse, the half of the stake in one of the time zones did not observe daylight saving time.)

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Postby russellhltn » Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:39 am

lajackson wrote:I think the assignment would have to be by building, not by ward/stake.


What about location-less events? For that it should be by ward which I would expect to be determined by their normal building. (Oh, I can see the fun now if they move buildings.....)

But location-less for stakes is a bit trickier. Would it be by the stake center?
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Postby lajackson » Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:48 am

RussellHltn wrote:What about location-less events? For that it should be by ward which I would expect to be determined by their normal building. (Oh, I can see the fun now if they move buildings.....)

But location-less for stakes is a bit trickier. Would it be by the stake center?


At first consideration, I would think the ward or stake meetinghouse would be a good default. Until, of course, the stake has a youth activity in another city. I just don't think the programmers can win on this one. [grin]

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Postby jdlessley » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:05 pm

I can see RBeatse's issue as it relates to those traveling away from their ward/stake's time zone. And I think it is a factor whether creating events or just viewing event times when physically located in another time zone. When a traveler looks at the calendar online they expect to see the event times in the time zone for which the event will occur and not the time zone in which the traveler may be at the moment when viewing the calendar. This is no different than a paper calendar of events which is printed and taken with a traveler. When the paper calendar is viewed while in New York it still shows the event times as they were printed in Salt Lake City. Should I add an event to that printed calendar I would write in the time using the same time zone as all the other events on that printed calendar and not using the time zone I am currently in.

When I travel and I am planning to attend an event for my ward I think of the event time in reference to the location the event is going to occur and not in reference to the time in the time zone I am physically in.

This idea of displaying the time for the event location can be accomplished to accommodate travelers such as RBeatse. The calendar program can be programmed to adjust time displays for a unit location. When a traveler is away from their home time zone the calendar can display a message that tells the traveler that all times are in [home unit time zone]. It is a matter of comparing the time zone the user's computer is in to the ward time zone.

There are times applications need to display times for the time zone the device is located. And there are times when applications need to display times for one location. I think the calendar should use the latter.
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